HAFJAK INTERVIEW 4 - BIPOLAR SELF-LOATHER

Tuesday, January 27, 2009, 10:00 AM

Ganerda Grul and HAFJAK DIVIZ, publisher and author respectively of the comic strip album "STOP MAKING CRAP" sit in Ganerda's kitchen in her house in Los Angeles. It is a cold, windy day in the city of angels. HAFJAK drinks black coffee from a white cup. Ganerda sticks with decaf tea. The tape recorder is rolling.

HAFJAK: I'm glad we're doing this. It's fun.

Ganerda: Thank you for being a good sport, and sorry for my caffeine meltdown the other day. I'm sticking with decaf (points to her cup).

HAFJAK: Naw, drink some coffee. Something interesting might happen.

Ganerda: Umm--yes. I have some questions. I wrote them down way back when I first saw your work. I really relate to your work, so--I would like some answers to these questions.

HAFJAK: Okay.

Ganerda: I'm sorry, but some of them might seem a little--umm--(thinking)

HAFJAK: It's okay. Ask me anything. Just not my real name.

Ganerda: umm--I just hope you won't be offended.

HAFJAK: Gan--

Ganerda: Sorry, okay--umm--firstly--Are you--

HAFJAK: Sick?

Ganerda: --Bipolar?

HAFJAK: (Laughs) No, I'm not. Well, wait. I've never been psychoanalyzed, so I don't know what I am. I might be. This book would be a sure indicator of such a condition.

Ganerda: But are you?

HAFJAK: I've never been officially diagnosed, no. Not yet.

Ganerda: Have you ever been diagnosed with any mental--setbacks? Depression?

HAFJAK: No. Like I said, not yet. Way back, I used to be heavy--fat--and I went to the doctor because I was fat and depressed. He prescribed (an antidepressant). I took it for a week, decided that it wasn't for me and lost the weight. And became happy again. That's the closest I've come to a "mental setback."

Ganerda: Are you on any medication now?

HAFJAK: No.

Ganerda: And you weren't depressed or on medication when doing PLUS-MINUS?

HAFJAK: I wasn't on meds. I might have been depressed. But not clinically depressed. As for being bipolar, I have my ups and downs like anyone else. Sometimes I'm less hopeful than at other times. How about that? Sometimes, I'm hope-impaired.

Ganerda: Okay...

HAFJAK: Why?

Ganerda: Well--I feel a strong connection to your work, and I'm wondering if that makes me like you, and, if so--

HAFJAK: You hope you're not sick.

Ganerda: Also, a lot of artists are being diagnosed as this or that, and it seems a lot of people want to believe the art was a product of some disorder or disease. I don't like that. I like to think that art is pure and not a hiccup or belch from some disease.

HAFJAK: I'm sure this topic has been covered by more worthy, educated people. Anyway, I'm fine. Actually, a bipolar person is either high or low, right? That's my understanding. PLUS-MINUS is all about being both at the same time. Or it's more like the yin and yang. I don't know. I wouldn't worry about it Gan. Most people laugh when they read the book.

Ganerda: Okay. But no history of insanity in your family?

HAFJAK: (Laughs) Nope. I'm the first.

Ganerda: Well, okay. You're not officially sick, but you are very hard on yourself if the book is any indicator. Why are you so hard on yourself? Is the book a product of self-loathing?

HAFJAK: (pause) Sure. Why not?

Ganerda: Seriously?

HAFJAK: Yeah. But with the whole HAFJAK thing, self-loathing goes hand-in-hand with self-loving. Good with bad, all that, you know? It's both at the same time.

I'm a very common, mediocre person. I'm not extreme by any means. An extreme person would be--a murderer or a saint. I'm--nobody. Just like everybody else. I'm a little good, I'm a little bad. I'm hard on myself because I know I'm bad. I deserve it. I get down on myself because--I suck. As a person, as a human being, sometimes I really suck. I'm just bad at it. So I call myself on it when I catch myself sucking. And I hope that will lead me to improve as a person.

Ganerda: But it's rare in your work that--the self-loving is not wholly apparent in your book.

HAFJAK: I think it's there. The fact that PLUS is there and keeps painting is evidence of that. Maybe even MINUS in some way represents a rather "tough love."

I know the book--especially as many times as we've read it--it seems tough and hard and abusive on a rather nice little character, but aren't all stories like that? You've got your hero, you throw him up against terrible odds, and he makes it through. The hero goes through all this pain and such, but that's heroes. They can take it, and they become stronger and wiser after their perilous quests and journeys. PLUS just goes on a rather small, claustrophobic, verbally abusive journey.

Ganerda: Do you still hear the MINUS voice verbally abusing you? Or PLUS?

HAFJAK: (pause) I recently read "Steppenwolf" by Hermann Hesse. It opened my mind but also allowed me to retain what my mind was before it was opened. It didn't change me. It just let me embrace more. There's a place in the human heart for a thousand different feelings and beings--there's a place for duality, a place for a completely unbiased perception--a place for the past, present and future. I'm very glad that there will always be a place in me for PLUS and MINUS. I hear them every day. I'm just glad that now I'm not limited to that narrow black and white perception of the world. But having that black and white, no BS view of the world has its uses and advantages.

(silence)

Ganerda: You're not on prescribed medications, but do you do drugs? Recreational drugs?

HAFJAK: I would like to. But I don't have time.

www.ganerda.com

GANERDA GRUL INTERVIEW 1 - CAFFEINE AND E-BOOKS

Tuesday, January 13, 2009, 10:00 AM

Ganerda Grul, publisher of controversial comic strip album "STOP MAKING CRAP," and HAFJAK DIVIZ, author and illustrator of "STOP MAKING CRAP,' sit in the backyard of Ganerda's house in Los Angeles. Coffee has been drunk. A tape recorder rolls and--Ganerda turns the recorder off.

HAFJAK turns the recorder back on.

Ganerda: umm--Can we turn that off? Just for a moment.

HAFJAK: What's wrong?

Ganerda: umm--(head between knees) I think it's the caffeine. I drank one cup too many. The caffeine is hitting me. And my anxiety--I just need to catch my breath. Can we turn the recorder off for just a few moments?

HAFJAK: No, this interview is finally getting interesting.

Ganerda: Why? Because I'm having heart palpitations?

HAFJAK: No. Let me interview you. You're more interesting.

Ganerda: Oh no--

HAFJAK: Relax. Let's get this moment on tape. You can cut it out if it's embarrassing. Why are you anxious?

Ganerda: Oh--just busy. Really busy. (head between legs, voice muffled by skirt)

HAFJAK: With Ganerda's Business?

Ganerda: Oh yeah, with everything. You know how it is. A lot of good things are happening, but it's all happening at the same time, and it's a lot.

HAFJAK: Regrets?

Ganerda: umm--We're supposed to be interviewing you--

HAFJAK: Yes. We did. I talked already. We did the interview.

Ganerda: "Interview." Are we pathetic? I mean, I can't even get you interviewed by a real magazine or radio thing. What are we going to do? Oh yeah, you're finishing up the press release, that's good. It looks really good.

HAFJAK: Why did you publish me?

Ganerda: umm--

HAFJAK: Come on. It's just me and you. We've had this conversation a dozen times. It should be part of the interview. Which is a good idea by the way. Why just sit and try to be interviewed by someone else when we can do it ourselves? That's what this whole operation is about, right? No BS, just do it, get it done and let it shine?

Ganerda: I guess so. Sorry, maybe I should have eaten breakfast.

HAFJAK: You didn't have breakfast? What do you usually have for breakfast?

Ganerda: umm--Toast? Oatmeal?

HAFJAK: From the packets? Steel-cut? Maple syrup flavored?

Ganerda: Oh God--(lifts head) Oatmeal. We're talking about oatmeal.

HAFJAK: Well--Why are you anxious?

Ganerda: Do you think we should have done an e-book instead? Or maybe just a website? With all your artwork on it? Or maybe we could have done a softcover--or just a series of, like, traditional comics, the pamphlet kind?

HAFJAK: So it's the book that has you anxious?

Ganerda: (pause) Can we turn off the recorder? It's just the caffeine. I'm going to get some more water. Do you want more water?

HAFJAK: Why did you publish me?

Ganerda: Because I love the book. I appreciate all the interpretations made of it. But I've always believed that it was PLUS'S book and how he carries on despite that nagging voice of doubt. It helped me to know that that little voice of fear will always be there but to keep going. To just do because--why not? What else was I going to do with my life? And my life is--it'll be over sooner than I think, and what will I have to show for it? I wanted your book to exist. It has to exist and now it does.

HAFJAK: Thanks to you.

Ganerda: Well--

HAFJAK: It was just laying around in my garage. I wasn't going to do anything with it.

Ganerda: Well--(beat) The press release art is almost done? We'll get that out to everyone.

And Wonder Con is coming up! Oh my god--I have to submit these forms and--Okay! Thank you for the interview HAFJAK! It was fun and revealing and--I have to use the restroom, excuse me.

www.ganerda.com

HAFJAK DIVIZ INTERVIEW 3 - TITLE AND PSEUDONYMITY

Tuesday, January 13, 2009, 9:00 AM

Ganerda Grul, publisher of "STOP MAKING CRAP," and HAFJAK (always in CAPS) DIVIZ, writer and illustrator of controversial comic strip album "STOP MAKING CRAP," sit in the backyard of Ganerda's house in Los Angeles. The sun is out and the yard is warming up.

More coffee is served. The tape recorder is on, and Ganerda reads off another question written in her notebook.

Ganerda: The title of your book is quite an attention grabber. Why did you choose it?

HAFJAK: That's why--it grabs you. I didn't think about it much. I was looking through the material when I was putting together the book, paused when I saw that strip and said "that's my cover." It was between that one and the "NOTHING YOU SAY OR DO MATTERS" painting. But the "NOTHING..." one was too bleak and surrendered. The "STOP MAKING CRAP" one was more of a challenge, a smack in the face. It describes perfectly what MINUS is doing to PLUS all through the book. And, of course, it was the closest thing to saying "F- you" right on the cover of a book.

The title can be interpreted a few ways. There's the eco meaning, like "stop making crap, you're wasting time, energy and resources on making unnecessary crap." A lot of people agree with the title. A lot of people read the title, sigh and nod their head wearily, like they're standing in K-mart, looking at all the junk piled ceiling high and thinking "Jesus, what a lot of crap! They should stop making crap!" So there's the clutter-crap interpretation.

Another interpretation is seeing the title through MINUS'S eyes: "Stop making bad art. Stop wasting your time and do something worth a damn. Go out and help at a soup kitchen or something."

Or one could interpret the title through PLUS'S eyes: "This bitter little guy is trying to stop me from doing what I want to do. Will he succeed? Will I quit? Should I quit?"

Ganerda: Which interpretation did you intend?

HAFJAK: All of it. I see it from both perspectives, PLUS and MINUS. When I was putting this book together, I was overjoyed to be creating something, to be fulfilling a lifelong dream. But I had a lot of misgivings as well. MINUS was in my head saying, "Come on, the world doesn't need another book, especially this nasty little book. You're just going to depress people! Leave the rainforest alone. Leave the Chinese child print labor alone." All that doubt and fear is in the introduction. That big speech MINUS gives in the intro--I had to cut that down and shrink it so it would fit in that huge word balloon. There was no end to my misgivings.

I do think all this stuff about art. I have a love-hate relationship with art. I think a lot of people do, especially with modern art. Being an artist, I've always felt I could be doing something more constructive and less self-absorbed. I could use my creative brain to solve problems, create solutions. Instead, I'm just using it to create more crap.

Ganerda: Do you agree with MINUS that PLUS is just making more crap?

HAFJAK: Yes and no. That's for the reader to decide after reading the book. Or to see that both sides present valid arguments. Me? I'm still reeling from my friend's interpretation of the book. I always thought PLUS was the hero. But MINUS is equally heroic. It's his inability to tolerate crap that elevates PLUS'S abilities and output. That said, I don't think MINUS would ever be content with anything. MINUS would complain that absolute perfection is "too perfect."

To answer your question. PLUS is making stuff and some of it is crap. He's making little mistakes and failures on his way to success. He's on a journey. He's not afraid to stumble and trip on his way even though he has this HELF mocking him every step of the way. That's why I think the "STOP MAKING CRAP" title is apt. It's a parental command to rebel against. It's a challenge. Life is a challenge. Any geek in high school knows that. There's always going to be a-holes and loudmouths complaining and criticizing. Hell, most times what they say is funny and true. Just gotta keep on, not lose sight of the goal. Eyes on the prize, chin up, chest out, back straight, let's have some fun, get strong and get it done before we die.

Ganerda: Thank you. Do you mind if I reveal your real name and how you look and stuff? Reveal some basic info about you, so readers get a visual of you?

HAFJAK: I would prefer not to. When others think HAFJAK, I want them to visualize the mask, the alias, the alter ego. If readers want to know who I really am, that's easy, especially with the internet. I'm not hiding anything, I don't think I can. I just hope they associate "STOP MAKING CRAP" with the mask. It's part of the art, the identity. The HAFJAK mask is more honest than my real face. My face is a grinning lie.

Ganerda: Wow. More coffee?

HAFJAK: Yes please.

www.ganerda.com

HAFJAK DIVIZ INTERVIEW 2 - MASKS AND INTERPRETATION

(CONTINUED FROM INTERVIEW 1)

Tuesday, January 13, 2009, 9:00 AM

Ganerda Grul, publisher of "STOP MAKING CRAP," and HAFJAK DIVIZ, writer and illustrator of "STOP MAKING CRAP," sit at Ganerda's kitchen table in her house in Los Angeles. Coffee is served, and a tape recorder is rolling.

HAFJAK: Is it on? What was that?

Ganerda: Sorry, I was just mumbling something to myself. So--you appear in your book, on the introduction page. You depict yourself as a masked man. Why is that?

HAFJAK: It's like the alias. I named the part of me that produces PLUS and MINUS. I made up a face as well.

Ganerda: On the introduction page, the depiction of you has no mouth, never talks but only writes. In fact, the newer drawings of HAFJAK depicts HAFJAK as having his mouth taped shut.

HAFJAK: Yes. Well--I suppose I'll explain that in the next PLUS-MINUS book. The essence of HAFJAK'S self-imposed silence is that--I myself have never gotten very far with talking. I'm not good at talking. I get lost in talking. Talking just seems to go round and round and this way and that. When I talk I try to say as little as possible and stay as close to the point as possible. See? Just talking about talking is getting me lost in talking.

Talking is great. But I'm write-it-down-and-draw-it guy. I work, create solid results and present those results to communicate and to obtain what I want. That's what HAFJAK is. He is an extreme of that. He is action and results. Or consequences. No talk. No thought. Just decision and execution. And results. Reactions.

I suppose that MINUS is the talking guy. He talks and complains all day and night. Criticizes. PLUS is pure creative energy. And HAFJAK is action.

Ganerda: All that ties into the division symbol motif in the art?

HAFJAK: Yes. HAFJAK is the divider. The divided. He's between these two paralyzed extremes.

Ganerda: You said that you're working on another PLUS-MINUS book?

HAFJAK: Yeah. Ideally, there should be three because "STOP MAKING CRAP" is without a doubt MINUS'S book. The next two should focus on HAFJAK and PLUS.

Ganerda: Wow, a "CRAP" trilogy! That would be nice. When do you have time to work on these books?

HAFJAK: I just love drawing. Last night, I came home, was eating dinner and found myself doodling on a newspaper. I just draw. All the time.

Ganerda: Ever the artist. But you've written and illustrated a book that sort of bashes artists.

HAFJAK: (Pause.) I state clearly on the intro page what the book is about. But, yeah, the book bashes sensitive artists and bitter critics alike. Creators and haters. The best reaction is when readers pick a side and root for either creator or hater. Showing the book has taught me a lot about art and communication. I'm used to making art but not showing it or seeing reactions to it. So the art is all mine until it's made public. Then, it's everybody's, and everybody makes their own interpretation. Sometimes the book is a mirror. A plumber reads the book and thinks it's about plumbing! A guy who works at a jewelry store I met on the bus thought it was about himself and his boss. I love every interpretation of my book. A friend of mine, she told me that this book is all about MINUS. He's the star, the hero of the book. It's his negativity or criticism that elevates Plus's abilities and art content. I was amazed at that interpretation. I always believed MINUS to be the antagonist, and it was PLUS'S book, about PLUS trying to make art and MINUS getting in the way. That interpretation blew my mind. I like showing my stuff now. I learn about my work, myself and others by showing it. It's fun even when someone reads the title and says to me, "Yeah, stop making crap!" Remember that? At A.P.E.?

Ganerda: Yes! Very interesting! That was a very angry man. The book title is rather inflammatory though--especially at a convention full of--luxurious items--and knick knacks and such. Unnecessary items.

HAFJAK: You can say it. "Crap." That's what MINUS would call it.

Ganerda: But PLUS makes it!

HAFJAK: Makes art. MINUS just believes it's crap. It's anything but.

www.ganerda.com

HAFJAK DIVIZ INTERVIEW 1 - ALIASES AND ORIGINS

Tuesday, January 13, 2009, 9:00 AM

Ganerda Grul, publisher of "STOP MAKING CRAP," and HAFJAK DIVIZ, writer and illustrator of "STOP MAKING CRAP," sit at Ganerda's kitchen table in her house in Los Angeles. Coffee is served, and a tape recorder is rolling.

Ganerda: Hello HAFJAK.

HAFJAK: Hello Ganerda.

Ganerda: I'd like to ask you some questions about the book, and I'll transcribe it and put it on my blog.

HAFJAK: Okay--sounds fun.

Ganerda: "HAFJAK" isn't your real name. It's a pseudonym.

HAFJAK: Yep.

Ganerda: Your real name doesn't appear anywhere on the book. Just "HAFJAK DIVIZ." You were very adamant about that. Why the alias and what does it mean?

HAFJAK: I like aliases--aliases were big in the eighties when I grew up: "Prince," "Madonna," "Cher." Those were the mainstream ones. I love when writers use aliases, like Mark Twain. I just saw a documentary on Twain. They explained his alias. His real name was Samuel Clemens. His alias "Mark Twain" was a sailing or nautical term meaning that there are two yards of water beneath a boat, and the boat is safe to pass through those waters without danger of hitting the bottom. Read into that what you will. Or don't. He used to work on riverboats. That's where he got the name. They would call out "mark twain!"

I like aliases because it's part of the project, part of the art. I'm creating not only the stuff but also the identity that creates the stuff. I always felt that PLUS-MINUS were coming from a dark corner in my brain, so I named that corner "HAFJAK DIVIZ." What does the name mean? It means I'm going to be sued! Have you seen how many hafjaks are out there?

Ganerda: We googled it. There's quite a few.

HAFJAK: Yes! I remember the day I sent you all the final files for the book. You were sending it to the printer. I got on the computer, looked up "HAFJAK"--again, saw all the hafjaks--again--and was about to call you to postpone the whole thing, so I could change the pseudonym!

Ganerda: You told me you had some doubts, but you didn't change the name. Why?

HAFJAK: I calmed down, then reasoned that there are thousands of Johns, a million Michaels, why not a whole lotta Hafjaks? If there's a legal issue, my case would be--hey, look in the phone book. There's John Smith, John Carter, John Jones. Why not Hafjak Miller, Hafjak Mignola or HAFJAK DIVIZ? Actually I think Hafjak is a polish female name.

Ganerda: I didn't realize you were that worried about it. So the name must really be dear to your heart.

HAFJAK: Yes, like I said, it's the name I gave to that portion of my personality where PLUS-MINUS come from, that dark dual place where things are black and white, good and ill, ever in combat and conflict.

Ganerda: Is that what "HAFJAK" means? "Conflict?'

HAFJAK: I suppose. It means divided: Jack's in half, divided, HAFJAK DIVIZ.

Ganerda: In caps, right?

HAFJAK: Always.

Ganerda: Why?

HAFJAK: Just how it comes out. Just came out as is. HAFJAK DIVIZ. a subconscious thing. I'm listening more to my subconscious and less to my doubts and fears.

Ganerda: That's good to hear! I feel the same way!

HAFJAK: What kind of artist would I be if I didn't follow my instincts and inner feelings?

Ganerda: Yes! What inner feelings brought you to do the PLUS and MINUS cartoons?

HAFJAK: I was doing a comic strip called "Frost & Miko." Not for a newspaper or anything, just for myself. It was about an ostrich and a raccoon or something, their wacky adventures. It was an "& strip." "Ren & Stimpy," "Tom & Jerry," "Bob & Doug MacKenzie." You hear that "&" and you know what the content is: Two idiots getting into trouble. "Laurel & Hardy."

The strip wasn't much. It ran out of steam and ended without becoming much of anything. It was an exercise. The characters looked like PLUS-MINUS. One was a tall bird, the other, a short rodent creature. One was happy, the other, less happy. When it ran out of steam, I was disappointed with it and myself. Why did it end when other characters seemed eternal and necessary? I unraveled myself, asked myself why I draw. What do I really want to draw? I concluded that "Frost & Miko" was just practice, a replication of what I had absorbed, an exercise.

Then I started drawing what was really on my mind, what stung me, what made me feel something and care about what I was doing. With "Frost & Miko," I was trying to make a strip everyone had seen before. When I started doing PLUS-MINUS, that stuff just came out. I didn't try to do anything except be true to myself.

A lot of PLUS-MINUS isn't funny to me, but it's true and it hits me. It's real. It represents my feelings of being an artist, the struggle to make something true and beautiful, the impossible attempt to create something original.

"COMIC BOOK STORY" at the end of the book was one of the first PLUS-MINUS things I drew. It encapsulates what PLUS-MINUS is.

Ganerda: The book isn't in chronological order?

HAFJAK: Not at all, in fact, I think it's backwards because I followed my subconscious. It told me that particular order was correct. It was. With that order, there's a happy ending.

(To be continued...)

www.ganerda.com